Jolie Shapiro00:01.769
Hello everyone, welcome to Revenue Mind, a podcast that see I need to start over. But I think it's working, so we're good. If it doesn't, just kill me. Alright, cool. Alright. Hey everyone. god, why am I like sorry? I just got back from Glacier National Park and my brain is like Alright, got this.
Amber Hollingsworth00:08.846
I think yeah, I think you're right. Okay. I think you're okay. That's okay, just take a breath. We got it, we got it.
Jolie Shapiro00:27.411
Thank you. I appreciate that. Or I love how I'm like I have to breathe for my own podcast. It's so sad. all right, breathing. All right. sh. All right. Hey everyone. Welcome to Revenue Mind, a podcast where Revenue Leaders talk all things mental health. I'm Julie your host, and with this is Amber. Welcome, Amber.
Amber Hollingsworth00:28.846
Yeah. Ha ha ha. Hey, thanks for having me. I'm happy to be here. I'm excited for our talk.
Jolie Shapiro00:49.435
Yeah, yeah, me too. So the first question I typically ask is what makes you you?
Amber Hollingsworth00:57.772
Well, that's a good that's a hard question, let's see. Gosh, there's just so many things. I guess I'll go with the what makes me do what I do now, which is I am from an addicted family and I'm an addiction like counselor specialist by training, but I'm also a business owner. And so I think that's what probably gives me my unique twist of things is sort of my my background in mental health. And then also my venture into business and going from being a counselor to being a business owner, that was a that was a pretty big jump for me. In fact, I like to say I didn't even realize I was a business owner until I got that first t year's tax bill. Then I was like, holy crap, I'm running a business. I have no idea what I'm doing. And it was like a spiral crisis from there.
Jolie Shapiro01:47.781
So just to clarify, so you are you're an L L C under mental health, like as a so you're doing both or you have a separate business?
Amber Hollingsworth01:57.314
No, I have a business for my practice. My mental health practice. Right. Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro01:59.845
Gotcha. Okay. Awesome. Yeah, my my mom's actually an L C S W.
Amber Hollingsworth02:04.819
Okay, okay, like mine then. Okay, very good. What's it like to be trained by like a therapisty person? Is that is that like traumatic on your childhood? It could be it could be a lot to have a therapisty mom, yeah.
Jolie Shapiro02:14.297
Not at all. But thank you for asking. No, no, no. appreciate that. Like usually I my guests are like, yeah. So this feels like a therapy session. But since I'm with a therapist, this might turn into my therapy session. So I gotta be careful. Anywho, yeah. No, I totally I I'm totally joking. yeah, so I'd love to hear about kind of your journey and how you got into this and your background. I know you mentioned the addiction in your family, but we'd just love for you to expand on that if you can.
Amber Hollingsworth02:30.125
We won't turn it on you. Yeah. Well, most people that do what I do as an addiction specialist, most people get into doing that for very like personal reason. Like usually they're in recovery themselves. And that's not exactly my journey here. I actually ended up here by accident. because I originally went to school to be school teacher. But and then That let me you, I taught high school for three years and that was just like murder. my God, that was so awful and hard. So I thought, well, let me let me see what else I can do. So I went back to school to get my master's degree and I thought, well, I'll just be a school counselor because I was in the school system, so it seemed natural. Well, once I started getting to the end of my program, I realized I can't afford to take off a whole year and be an intern. Like I gotta like pay my bills. So at the last second I changed my major to community mental health and they put me in an addiction program. And because I'd taught high school for you know five minutes and because I had, you know, a few weeks of training in some sort of adult addiction program, they decided that I would be the best person to design, like create and run an addiction program for teenagers. And so I didn't want to tell them that I didn't know what I was doing. So I said, absolutely, yes, I'll do that. And I jumped into the deep end, no life jacket, no nothing. It was so scary. I was in so far over my head it wasn't even funny. It was definitely sink or swim, but I was just gonna go with it. I wasn't gonna say otherwise. That was like my first big girl counselor job. I wasn't gonna tell them otherwise. I just did it. That's how I got here. A lot of people think I got here because I came from such an addicted family, but which is true. As in like addiction everywhere, aunts, uncles, cousins, brothers, sisters, parents, everywhere. Like really bad. Like my mom was doing meth with my sister bad. But the crazy part about that is that I didn't even realize that until I was in the field. Not that I didn't realize people were doing substances, but I wouldn't have attached that word, addiction to it, because when you grow up in it, it's just you're normal. Like you don't even think anything about it. So I wish I could say, you know, I grew up in this and it inspired me to get in the field. It's not actually the case. I got in the field and then realized it looking backwards.
Jolie Shapiro05:05.792
That's it's it's wow, that is a that is a powerful story. Usually it kind of works the other way around, you know. so like you re not that you didn't realize, but like I have friends that are also LACs and they a lot of them struggled with addiction so they became LACs, but you
Amber Hollingsworth05:15.937
Right. I know. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro05:33.664
saw y everything exploding around your family. But that was normal.
Amber Hollingsworth05:36.406
Uh-huh. Right. Right. Yeah, you don't you don't realize whatever you grow up in feels normal, right? Like you don't realize that that's not the way every I mean, you just don't think anything about it, right? It's your normal. So I really wish I had a better origin story. I'm so jealous of people who have that good origin story. And I'm like, dude, I got here by accident. Cause people always like, always the first question I get asked, and they want this people expecting like this big crazy wild story. I'm like, dude, I wish. In the beginning when I was first in the field, I really was pretty self conscious about it because it it really is just the first question, not just for podcasts, but like when you get a new client or whatever, like that's the first thing people want to know is are you in recovery? And when I first started that teenage program, they would ask me that and and I didn't want to say no I wasn't because I knew they would just immediately be like, my god, you you don't know anything. And so I would say, I'll tell you when you graduate because by the time they graduated they would already I've won them over. So And then they w you know, if they remembered they'd ask me again and I'd tell or whatever, but it didn't matter then. I used to be really like, you know, self-conscious about that because most people that are in this field are in recovery. And it was definitely a liability for me in the beginning because I really didn't know what I in the end, I feel like it's it's part of what makes me me, like the question you asked me because I feel like I had to work way harder than most people because I didn't know anything. So I feel like I had to listen more deeply to the people that I was talking to and find other ways of connecting and and building a relationship. kinda like like if you're blind, your hearing might get better or something. For me, I feel like that's the way it it worked for me. So in the end I feel like it's made me have like a special superpower, but in the beginning definitely.
Jolie Shapiro07:26.399
So are you cut out? Is that me?
Amber Hollingsworth07:27.819
Okay.
Jolie Shapiro07:31.359
We're okay. Might have been no I you just cut out a little bit. I don't think that was my headphones. It might have been potentially your microphone. But we're we got most of it. We got most of the most of the juice. Did you wanna repeat Yeah, feel free to repeat I think that last last couple of lines.
Amber Hollingsworth07:32.525
Are we okay? Okay, good. Okay, good. I can repeat it if I need to. Okay, I was just saying that, you know, in the beginning it really was like a liability because not only did I not have a recovery experience myself, but also, you know, people think they teach you this in counseling school and they do not. Like you get one class on addiction and it involves go to a couple of twelve step meetings and come back, write a report, tell us what you thought. Seriously, like that's it. That's all you get in counseling school. So I didn't have the like professional training background. I didn't have the experience background. I had nothing. And so when I was starting this program, my whole goal was to fly under the radar and keep my job, right? And so I decided that in order to do this, the program I was running was like intensive outpatient for teenagers, which meant that they had to show up three times a week, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, from six to nine PM, three hour sections three times a week. Addicted teenagers. And so My thought was if these kids don't show up, I'm gonna lose my job. They're gonna know I don't know what I'm doing. So my whole mission was to make these kids show up. And so in the end, that's actually kind of cool because it's what made the program work because I really focused in on making it not a horrible experience so that they would show up and and then I, you know, wouldn't be caught not knowing what I was doing. And so because of that and because they let me design the program, kind of developed this whole system where like, If they graduated the program, they could keep coming back and be mentors to the other teens as long as they wanted to for free. As long as they weren't like wreaking havoc or anything. They could do that. And they liked to come. And so they wanted to be mentors. They wanted to keep coming. So they all got sober so they could be mentors and keep coming. So the whole thing worked. It was kinda cool.
Jolie Shapiro09:32.668
That's amazing. Aside from the mentor program within the actual program with the teenagers, what how did you make it where they came back?
Amber Hollingsworth09:42.03
You know, I really just focused on trying to build a relationship with them. A lot of addiction programs, there's this kind of like culture or mindset of there's just sort of like this feeling of like Come back when you want it. Like, if you're not willing, if you don't want it, you we'll be here. You go out there and suffer some more. There's an attitude about it, right? Well, I wasn't gonna have that attitude because I needed these kids to show up, you know, keep my job. So like I sort of went against that grain and built a relationship. And and in order to do that, all you gotta do is like like them and they'll like you back. Honestly, and you gotta be interested in them genuinely and like like them and they'll and they'll like you back. And they'll show you the better like version of themselves, which makes them actually easy to like, you know, and they're y you get the real version, not like the defensiveness and that kind of and so I feel like that's what made the whole thing work. And honestly, to this day, twenty years later, that's still what I do. Because I just build a relationship with people. And I do it by being very different than what they expect, by not having that attitude. You know, I don't see myself as like your probation officer. Like you're not I'm not the principal's office, which I think is what a lot of people expect when they come to some kind of addiction counseling. So like I tell my clients, I'm like, Dude, I'm your defense attorney. Like I see myself, I'm the person that's got your back, right? Because you're in a mess if you gotta come see me. No one believes you, you're in some kind of hot water, and I'm here to get you out of it. And so I'm on your side. We're aligned. We're in this together. I got you. And I think they don't really expect that, right? They don't expect for me to listen to them and their point of view and what they think about the situation. And that I think it goes a long way to build trust. And now we have like a working relationship.
Jolie Shapiro11:25.624
Yeah, I was I was laughing earlier because I got kicked out of IOP. I know. No, I wasn't I just couldn't stop drinking. I just like it was a it was a night it was sorry, maybe I didn't get kicked out of Iop no no no sorry. No, I said actually said it wrong. I did there was I was in New York and there was like this three day a week program, but it was for under ninety days.
Amber Hollingsworth11:30.143
You got kicked out of IOP? What did you do to get kicked out of IOP? Okay.
Jolie Shapiro11:53.623
was to get you to ninety days and I just couldn't I couldn't even last a day. Yeah. So they actually recommended me to IOP and I'm like, peace. And then eight years later, twelve steps and here I am, four and a half years sober. So, you know, work works for something works for everyone. It just kinda depends.
Amber Hollingsworth11:57.474
Just couldn't do it. Yeah. A lot of it's timing, right? Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro12:15.255
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I've I mentioned this on I think previous podcasts, but I had a actually an LAC licensed addictions counselor tell me, Jelly, what do you s what do you stop drinking? Just try. Just try for like a day. And I was like, Wait, no, I can't. So So the the next day I'm like, Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna go to twelve steps and see what's up and it it works when you work it, as they say in program.
Amber Hollingsworth12:27.085
Yeah. That's right. What made you decide after that counselor asked you that? What what changed in your thinking or clicked with you that made you decide to try twelve step?
Jolie Shapiro12:49.375
Yeah, so I actually I don't I actually don't think I've talked about this, which is typically what happens with my guests, but why not? so I had a I had an encounter with with actually a psychologist who who kind of took advantage of my mental state and the next day I said I'm done. That was my rock bottom. I was just I'm done. Yeah.
Amber Hollingsworth13:16.235
Really? Wow. That's like terrible and great. I don't even know what to think about that. Like I'm my head is like what? I don't even know. Gosh. That's like messed up.
Jolie Shapiro13:19.413
Yeah. Yeah, my it was pretty pretty I'll just say it fucked. It was pretty fucked up. You're much more appropriate than me. I tend to curse a lot. I'm trying to trying to be better, but it tends to slip out. that's good. No no no, I'll I'll I'll tone it down. yeah, it was it was pretty it was pretty intense, but I honestly I've I never I didn't report him because he lived in my building.
Amber Hollingsworth13:33.771
Yeah, yeah. You're that's exactly right. Yeah, it is. It's okay, I'm speaking appropriate because I'm a guest here, so I'll I'll act right. I'll try to act right. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro13:58.364
And it's pretty obvious who would report you. And the years went on and honestly I just I thank him, you know. I wouldn't be where I am today without what happened. You know, you can look at it, you can look at it, man, like you know, trauma or you can kinda and work and but then you can also look at it like, thank you, and now I'm gonna work through it in therapy.
Amber Hollingsworth14:10.263
Well Mm-hmm. Right, right, right, right. Yeah. No.
Jolie Shapiro14:26.109
Yeah, so that that's a little bit about my story, but
Amber Hollingsworth14:29.441
Well, I like this why I tell my clients, there's no bad reason. I've never heard a reason I didn't like. You know, people say this thing, they say this thing, like, you have to do it for yourself. I'm like, that's baloney. No one no one who's alcoholic quits drinking because they don't want to drink. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. No one wants it for themselves. Like everyone who stops an addiction stops because something bad, like something external, something bad, a rock in her place. And there's no bad reason to do it. Like if it's like I don't want my kids to be taken, I think that's great. If it's I don't wanna lose my husband or my wife, fantastic. If it's I don't wanna go to prison, even better. Like that's just good judgment. Like there's no bad reason, you know?
Jolie Shapiro15:10.641
Exactly. Obviously you won't you won't name names, but is there like a super maybe like a really complicated case where you were able to keep that that relationship dynamic that you built that was able to, you know, kind of get them to the other side?
Amber Hollingsworth15:27.693
You know, I don't I don't know if I can think of a specific case, but I can tell you that a even those teenagers that I first started with, I still see some of them now and they have their own kids, you know, like their grown-ups and all that kind of stuff. A lot of the people I see, they'll they'll come to me off and on at different periods of their life. And and sometimes it's like they come to see me for addiction, but later on something else happens. It's not even addiction related, but we have like a trust relationship. So they'll come back. We'll just work through whatever the heck it is they're g they're working on, you know. Cause my goal is like When I get a new person, my thinking isn't like, okay, I gotta make this person get sober and stay sober forever. Like that's not my thinking at all. My thinking is I gotta make sure this person has a good experience. So that if now's not their time, And maybe it's their time in six months or two years or five years. They're not gonna be scared to either come back to see me or or go anywhere else and get help that they want to. You know, I just wanna make sure they don't have one of those horrible experiences that makes them be like, I'll never do that again. I'm never 'cause a lot of people do, you know. And and because of that, I think the clients that I've that I've worked with over the years, you know, they they come back. And I see multiple people in their family or I'll see them on and off for different things. And it's really cool to get to watch people learn and grow and change and build a life they love.
Jolie Shapiro16:50.642
Sorry, I was trying to mute myself. I was like this. No, that's that's amazing. I mean, just I I have a lot of respect for for what you do, especially IOP. It's nine hours a week is is pretty intense. And so so I was in a PHP for another another addiction. I was talking to someone, I was like, I don't just have to have one, I can have multiple. Why not have multiple addictions?
Amber Hollingsworth17:12.309
Okay. if you've got one, chances you'll have another are pretty good. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro17:19.693
Exactly. Exactly. The comorbidity. So people people there, my gosh, like VIOP, PHP, residency. I have real, real respect for people that do that because it's a you know, it's a lot for for quote not quote unquote. It's lot for for us, you know, the patients that are ten hours a day, 70 hour weeks for for me was over two months. And then another four for VIOP, but for the people that lead it.
Amber Hollingsworth17:38.071
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro17:49.712
Whew. Like I I hear from my friends, like they are just exhausted. They are exhausted. They are so it's an amazing thing obviously to do, but I can't imagine how much effort that takes to you know, to step into someone's shoes to establish that relationship. It's just whew, a lot of respect.
Amber Hollingsworth17:54.914
Yeah. Right. Well, I think that i especially if you go into it thinking it's my job to make sure this person gets sober or they never drink or use or whatever again, you're gonna be stressed out and the average like lifespan of an addiction counselor is five years in the field, which is wild because it takes more than five years to be able to do this work, like to even get the schooling to do it. And so, if you come in with that mindset, I think that's what leads to that culture of comeback. when you want it, because there's just this frustration. And then what happens to like addiction counselors is like if this isn't working, it's their fault, right? They're not ready or they're not willing or they don't have insight or they're in denial or whatever. And for me, it's not that stressful because I don't put that pressure on myself. Like I said, my job is to make sure this is not a horrible experience for this person. And that makes it so much easier. Right. And and I was honestly it makes it so much easier. And the better chances of them getting sober, right? Because I don't have this pressure on myself, which means I don't burn out as easily, right? Like my job is just to connect to you. I tell my client, my job is is to help you do whatever it is you're trying to do. Like my job is to be on your side. You tell me what we're doing, we're gonna do it, right? And if that didn't work, we got plan B, plan C, plan E, whatever. We're gonna figure it out. And and I don't stress about it. And that allows me to I think have the energy and the motivation to keep at it. Cause you really would be like down in the dumps if you tied your sort of professional well being to to other people's sobriety. Because it takes people multiple times. Like it it's good it takes you a lot of times, like that's normal, you know. So
Jolie Shapiro19:52.373
But thank god I have an editor because like these kinds of these kinds of things. I'm sure I'm sure he's la I tell us every I say this every time, I'm sure he's laughed watching like doing the recordings. Because he's like he's probably like, this girl. anyways, wait, you were saying do do do do your last line, sorry, the ADHD'd.
Amber Hollingsworth19:56.906
Okay. Yeah. Hmm. I was just saying how, because I don't put that pressure on myself to make sure that everyone that sits in front of me like never drinks or uses again or whatever, it's just a lot easier for me to stay in the game, I think, as opposed to getting burned out and frustrated and that kind of bad mindset that that ha like compassion fatigue kind of.
Jolie Shapiro20:33.802
Yeah, that makes total sense. If you do happen to get burned out, do you have any tips or tricks, just kind of in general in that field?
Amber Hollingsworth20:43.241
I think if you get burned out, I I think you gotta underst like look at why it is. Is it like I don't like doing this work or is it like I don't like working for this company I'm working for or I hate my boss or I don't like my hours. You know, there could be a lot of different pieces to it. If it's about the actual work, like working with clients who have mental health or addiction, then it's about changing your mindset on what you're trying to do. If you'll just shift, you'll feel reframed out of it, you'll feel less frustrated, I think.
Jolie Shapiro21:13.525
So cognitive behavioral therapy reframe.
Amber Hollingsworth21:16.065
Sort of, yeah. Yeah. Like what am I trying to accomplish here, right? Yeah.
Jolie Shapiro21:20.767
Yeah, versus like, I hate everyone. It's like, Well, there are a couple of people I like.
Amber Hollingsworth21:26.529
Yeah, it be yeah, it could be like that. These days, you know, I'm really lucky 'cause I have my own practice. I don't do IOP anymore. I mostly I see and this just sort of happened, but mostly these days I see like businessmen who drink to me. Just kinda like this weird like little sub specialty that fell on me 'cause I just love them. I love I say I love an alcoholic. I know that's crazy, but I just love an alcoholic. And the and the business owners, I really relate to them and so like And they're not all business owners. Like I see a lot of like what I would call like A-type people, like physicians, airplane pilots, attorneys, that kind of they're real driven. I think that's why I like alcoholics, because they tend to be real like ambitious, like go getting charismatic kind of people. You honestly. So I I kind of get to see who I want to see now. So it's even even better. It's even easier.
Jolie Shapiro22:18.184
I just wanna make so they're they're sober while they're flying the plane. Okay.
Amber Hollingsworth22:22.421
Yes. Let me tell you what, like it's r airplane pilot that's probably the strictest you can get. Way stricter than anywhere else. They are, but that doesn't mean they don't have an alcohol problem. Like yeah.
Jolie Shapiro22:37.054
Yeah, I mean I when I ooh shit, I'm so sorry. my gosh. Thank god thank God we're doing your clips and not mine. One second. There we go. Alright. No, yeah, I mean there there are many just people in super high power positions that are sober and that's it's I think it's okay to be sober. And I feel like there's I'd love to get your opinion on this. I feel like there's a there's still a little bit of
Amber Hollingsworth22:40.205
You're okay. Okay.
Jolie Shapiro23:05.523
prejudice against people with mental illness and addiction. Do you think it's evolving and maybe going away with the conversations or do you think there's still a little bit of well you can't talk about that.
Amber Hollingsworth23:22.497
To be honest, like, you know what my clients worry about? They worry about what people are gonna think if they don't drink or don't use anymore, more than anything. You know, people talk about the stigma of addiction keeping people from getting help. I I mean, yes, I think that might could be it, but the bigger thing about why people don't get help for addiction is because they're they have ambivalence about it and they're not sure if they wanna stop and they don't wanna be like forced into stopping if they're not sure. It's really a lot more than about that than it is the stigma now. Because I do see a lot of like professionals and businessmen. There is a stigma sometimes about like getting help because of like their professional reputation. So sometimes they'll like look out of town or virtual or something like that. That's a thing. But I tell my clients, I'm like, dude, everybody who's anybody's in recovery. It's literally like the cool thing to be. All the cool rock stars and boosters, like, what are you talking about? Like it's trendy. Yeah.
Jolie Shapiro24:16.028
Yeah, for sure. And there's a huge movement for non alcoholic beverages. I mean, everywhere I go I mean this in Colorado, like everywhere I go there's a non alcoholic slash mocktail option.
Amber Hollingsworth24:20.06
yeah. I know and they're getting better and better, clients are always telling me like 'cause used to there was just like O duels or whatever. But these days there's like all these cool options. Yeah.
Jolie Shapiro24:36.123
Yeah, I just feel like there's a there's a line between drinks that taste like juice and drinks that takes closer to alcohol. And it's like NA beer or NA wine or NA XYZ. It's like, mm, no, I'm not gonna mean maybe some people can probably test it. I I can't because I'm just I I'll go right back. I think what I
Amber Hollingsworth24:43.958
Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I've I've had it work both ways for clients. Some clients think it really helps them and some clients say it's a trigger. So it can go either way.
Jolie Shapiro25:07.352
Exactly. I'm trying to think of just give me a sec, this is where I'm like I have five questions, but I would just want to ask one. Like spinning in my head. Again, editor. do do do do do. I usually have my little notepad, but I'm s doing this new like setup, so now I'm just standing. So it's off the top of my head. okay, let's see.
Amber Hollingsworth25:26.795
Okay.
Jolie Shapiro25:36.427
If there's one thing you could tell someone that is currently going through an addiction, active addiction, what would you say?
Amber Hollingsworth25:44.758
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I would say don't listen to all these like negative statistics and stuff that are out there. Like I hate it when people are like, only 10% of people beat this thing. I'm like, dude, people beat this thing every day. And most people beat it without everyone to treatment. That's what the research does. So don't listen to all that negativity. And I don't care if you've tried it 10 times, it takes everyone 10 times. Like each one of those times you learn something. And instead of seeing it as like, well, I always mess up, it's like, dude, like what are you learning along the way? We're getting there. It is a learning process like anything. So I just say don't listen to all that. Like people people just make it bigger than it has to be. They say, No one makes it and you're just gonna have you're gonna be this for the rest of your life and you're gonna have to go to meetings forever. You're gonna re I mean, I'm like, my gosh, like you're not I hate it when people say things like that 'cause I'm like, you're not making a recovery sound appealing. Like that's not selling it very well.
Jolie Shapiro26:43.424
Exactly. Yeah. I I still go to meetings probably about once a month with one of my really good friends and just to be like a refresh, I call it a refresh because yeah, I've said this probably plenty of times on on different podcasts, but basically for me if I don't treat it as one day at a time, that's when I go back.
Amber Hollingsworth26:49.709
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro27:04.821
If I if I get comfortable, like the a couple of years ago I made this comment like, huh, I wonder if I could appreciate the taste of wine. Addicth thought. It's like a total total addict thought. It's like, yeah, I can I could I'd be in and out for eight years. I can handle this. Then you know, showing up like hung over as you know, hung over AF at a at work and having to go to home. So I would walk straight to an AA meeting. It's like you you
Amber Hollingsworth27:16.821
Yeah, right, yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro27:33.626
I'm not I'm not a high functioning alcoholic. I'm a very low I'm a very low functioning alcoholic. So I just kinda stopped there. But anyways, yeah, this was great. Anything you wanna anything you wanna leave for the the guests? Excuse me, let me start it over. This was great. Anything you wanna leave for people listening?
Amber Hollingsworth27:35.871
Okay. Okay. Yeah. what do you you know your audience the best. What do you think your audience wants or needs most when it comes to this topic?
Jolie Shapiro28:01.854
Yeah. I think something probably like, no, it's a great question. I think it's about so this this podcast is about I really liked what you said about the high performing the businessman. That's actually a lot of what our audience is, is like founders, CEOs, VPs of marketing, VPs of sales. So I guess like probably you could probably do like a bit about again, that's why I've been under. I've left he's so good.
Amber Hollingsworth28:15.319
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jolie Shapiro28:30.099
I would do a bit about like if you're in if you're like a high powered executive X, if you want to speak to that.
Amber Hollingsworth28:35.701
Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah, yeah. So I think when you especially if you're in business, a lot of times your job involves drinking. It's like literally part of your job description. Like I can't tell you how many people I've seen that are like marketing and sales and their job was to like take clients out and drink with them. Like and I'm like, dude, no wonder you ended up here. So I think that's a big part of it. Like business, relationships, like there's a piece of that that involves drinking that definitely contributes to the issue. But there's also sort of like this and you know, I don't know if this is in a book somewhere. This is just my experience, but there's this personality trait of people that are really driven and they're really ambitious and they're really go-getters. And I think it it kind of leads towards drinking too much because it's like they don't know how to turn that part of their brain off. Like at the end of the day, like they know how to get things done, but they don't know how to sit and just be or just chill with their family. are just relax at like a family event. They don't know how to do that. And they feel like uncomfortable and squirmy in those situations. So they drink in order to be able to do that. Because they're trying to work against their operating system. That's what I call it. and so it there's just a lot of reasons why you might end up with a drinking or any other, it doesn't have to be alcohol to be any other substance. I just find that it a lot of times it is alcohol because they're using it to try to relax or they don't know how to turn that part of their brain off. And so my thinking is let's not turn that part of your brain off. Like instead of trying to be something you're not, like let's figure out who you are and roll with it instead of trying to like fit yourself in some spot that you don't fit in, you know?
Jolie Shapiro30:16.519
Makes total sense. I feel like putting yourself or score peg round hole syndrome really gets to people. Like for me, alcohol was shutting my brain off, kind of to your point. Mine was because I had really interesting things going through my brain. But I also am very type A. I'm very, very type A, very O C D, you know, just that typical just perfectionist, you know. Everything that an eating disorder is like, you know, everything that an addict is.
Amber Hollingsworth30:22.005
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm. Okay. Right. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Uh-huh. Yeah.
Jolie Shapiro30:45.907
Where we where we end up and where we're, you know, in getting help. But no, that makes t that makes total sense. I I really relate to that. Cool. so where do we find you? Would love to we'd love to hear the deets.
Amber Hollingsworth30:57.591
Yeah. Well, of course my name is Amber Hollingsworth and you can find me anywhere. You know, I'm on all social medias. But the best place to find is on YouTube. I'm really considering myself a YouTuber mostly. And the channel's name is kind of strange, shall I tell you what it is, called Put the Shovel Down. A lot of people are like, What does that mean? It's an old recovery saying that one of the teenagers in that first program I used to run, he used to say it all the time, say, You hit your bottom when you when you put your shovel down. And I am a big fan of that. I'm not a big fan of waiting for people to hit like these horrible bottoms. You know, I'm like, dude, you can be done. Put the shovel down. You don't have to burn every bridge. You don't have to be miserable or lose all the relationships. Like, we don't gotta go there. You just you can decide, nah, this is this is bad enough, I think. I'm so you can find me on YouTube at put the shovel down.
Jolie Shapiro31:49.712
Awesome, this is great. Thank you so much. Really appreciate it, Amber.
Amber Hollingsworth31:53.035
No, thank you for having me. This has been great. I appreciate it, Jolie.
Jolie Shapiro31:56.742
Of course.